Recombinant Podcasting
When I interviewed for my current job, one of my interrogators asked me an interesting question: if Apple gave me carte blanche to pursue any project that interested me, what would I work on? My answer? Easy: social software for audio! No other project could combine my various passions (web services, audio and music, the iPod, social software, esoteric machine learning/psuedo-AI stuff) in such a complimentary way. I still find myself thinking quite often that if I was to leave Apple for anything it would be to start some sort of social music software company.
The question, though, is what should social software for music look like? I think my most important insight on the matter comes from an offhand remark someone (who I’m not sure if I should name) made to me about Odeo: that to really separate themselves from Apple and everyone else in the podcasting arena, Ev and company need to build “Flickr for audio.”
This struck me as a perceptive observation, because it squares very well with something I’ve long thought of as the first rule of social software: to really work, it must be a game. This idea was first suggested to me by Giant Ant Design’s seminal weblog post arguing that Flickr is actually a MMORPG, and I’ve noticed it holds true for all of the social software I really enjoy using. Even with the seemingly utilitarian del.icio.us, I have to admit to checking my bookmarks page once in awhile just to see how many people in my informal social bookmarking network have approved of the links I’ve posted by bookmarking them themselves.
Apple isn’t (at least that I know of) really aware of this principle yet, but the folks at Odeo do seem to understand it intuitively. I’ve already added my Odeo music podcast to the list of my social outputs I idly survey while I’m waiting for world builds at work. This also includes weblog stats, my del.icio.us page, Technorati ego searches, del.icio.us linkbacks to weblog posts, and my Flickr stream’s recent activity. Like all of those things, my Odeo podcast provides some basic ways (episode downloads, podcast subscribers, comments, Odeo rank) for me to “keep score” and know how I’m doing in the Odeo “game.”
As important as all of that is, though, I think the seed of the true killer social music app might lie in an interesting phenomenon I’ve noticed on del.icio.us–something I’ve dubbed “recombinant podcasts.”
You see, while the front end of my podcast is handled by Odeo, the back end RSS feed is actually generated by del.icio.us–that is, when I want to add something to my podcast, I just upload the file to my web server and bookmark it in my del.icio.us feed, which Odeo then picks up.
Since my entire podcast is also available via del.icio.us, and the underlying files on the server are available for anyone to link to, I’ve noticed that a number of del.icio.us users have actually added songs I’ve posted to their own del.icio.us bookmarks by using del.icio.us’ “copy” feature. The really interesting thing about this, though, is that several of them (including Dom, Odeo’s cracker jack new QA lead), have clearly added them to their own podcasts (as evidenced by the “dom.net:podcast” tag Dom added in this example).
This is notable because it reminds me of another thought I’ve had about how a social music application would differ from Flickr: with Flickr, you’re selling either your skills or experiences; with a social music app (such as my Odeo podcast), you’re selling your taste. It’s therefore very easy for me to imagine a social music sharing application built on Flickr-like MP3 streams, episodes of which could be copied from one stream to another (giving rise, naturally, to the power laws, A-lists, tastemakers, and so forth that make social applications such compelling games to so many people).
Of course, all of this is assuming someone could solve the copyright problems involved. A big “if,” to be sure, which is why you won’t see me quitting my day job just yet.
October 18th, 2005 at 6:00 am
Thanks for this really insightful comment about social software. I think you are dead on that part of the secret sauce is to turn these applications into a game. I am working on a social software product (www.blinklist.com) and we are still working hard at making it better and making it more like a game, enhancing the fun element of it to encourage more user participation.
Since you are into online discovery engines for music, I thought you might like to check out this link. I found a great new site “Hype machine” that you might be interested in:
http://www.blinklist.com/tag/discovery%20engine/
October 18th, 2005 at 8:31 am
I’m not sure I get what you’re doing with Odeo. Your “music podcast” link is broken (no URL in the A tag), but I searched Odeo for “scifihifi” and found your page. It looks like you are uploading MP3s to your server and then creating del.icio.us bookmarks for them, tagged with “scifihifi:podcast”. Which is a really interesting idea!
Unfortunately, when I tried to subscribe to the RSS feed with iTunes, it says there are “no playable episodes”. I think this is because the MP3 URL appears in the permalink of the article, not in an enclosure tag? So I’m wondering how one listens to your podcast besides viewing the feed in a newsreader and clicking the links one by one…
The copyright issues are a bitch. I think the only way to do this in the present environment is under-the-radar, as you’re doing it. Or alternatively via a P2P app that’s general-purpose enough that it can’t be sued out of existence in the post-Grokster legal climate.
October 18th, 2005 at 8:54 am
Oh, sorry–I guess I should have explained that a little more clearly. Essentially, you’re correct: I upload files to my server, add them as bookmarks in del.icio.us, tag them with “scifihifi:podcast,” and then have Odeo check my del.icio.us RSS feed for my links tagged with “scifihifi:podcast” and “system:media:audio.” Since del.icio.us has its media support feature, URLs to media files automatically get enclosures in the resulting RSS feed. Essentially, Odeo is merely a pretty front end for the del.icio.us feed that provides standard social software features like comments, contacts, stats, etc.
As for the issue of subscribing in iTunes, the following URL works fine for me:
http://del.icio.us/rss/ldandersen/scifihifi:podcast+system:media:audio
Again, del.icio.us automatically adds the enclosure tags now, so it should be a valid podcast.
October 19th, 2005 at 11:41 pm
I like the Odeo “game” concept, Buzz. This whole sociable audio space has a kind of ‘Calvin Ball’ feeling to it - where the rules keep shifting.
The question for me is: Buzz - how are you getting away with posting MP3s of other peoples’ music to your server? Where do we draw the line between broadcasting and podcasting?
November 1st, 2005 at 12:38 pm
How would macjams.com play in to your idea?
November 3rd, 2005 at 10:48 pm
There is a pretty fully developed scheme for doing similar things at http://www.annodex.net.
They are always looking for contributors.
December 6th, 2005 at 3:55 am
Hey Buzz, what do you think of http://last.fm
kinda like an audio flickr?
BTW - the player wouldn’t work on my 10.3.9 system?